Tell us about your community growing up. Looking back, how did they shape who you are now?

My parents, older brother, and I immigrated to the United States from Egypt when I was two years old.  My mother was one of seven children, and her older sister Suzan was the trailblazer – she came to the U.S. a few years earlier, and then convinced my grandparents, parents, aunts, and uncles to make the brave move too.  We moved to Pico Rivera, California, where several of us lived in the same apartment together until my parents could afford their own apartment in the same complex.  Growing up, I was always surrounded by my large extended family – lots of love, food, noise, and children running around.  We also grew up deeply entrenched in the Coptic Christian community and faith.  As an Egyptian immigrant in Pico Rivera (and later at UC Irvine and UCLA Law), I always felt like an “other” and that I did not fully fit into the “American” culture or the Egyptian culture.  To survive and thrive, I became a chameleon of sorts – always trying to blend into whatever environment I found myself in.  As I got older, I began to feel comfortable in my own skin and began appreciating the unique perspective I brought to the table.  I think my ability to relate to others who are different from me has helped me be an empathetic and effective lawyer and advocate. 

Describe your journey to law school. What motivated you to enroll?

I’m a proud product of the public school system from kindergarten through law school.  I did not have any lawyers in my family and did not know anyone who was a lawyer growing up, except for my fourth grade teacher who left the law for teaching.  I remember having to write a paper in her class about what I wanted to be when I grew up, and I could not decide between being a lawyer or being a teacher (I have no clue why those were my two options).  She told me that lawyers made more money and that was the tie-breaking fact I needed!  So from that point on, I told everyone that I wanted to be a lawyer.  My interest was confirmed during my government class in high school when we had a mock trial.  I went on to major in Political Science at UC Irvine, and attend law school at UCLA.

What was your law school experience like?

Although I found law school classes (and the forced grading curve) very intimidating, I loved law school.  And in particular, I feel in love with Moot Court during my 2L year.  During one of my first arguments, I remember one mock judge telling me that I was very easy to listen to.  That comment gave me the boost I needed to know that I could do this, even though I had never competed in anything like it before, and I ended up making it to the final round.  I was then selected to represent UCLA in the State Team competition the next year and I became the President of the Moot Court program.  My experience in Moot Court gave me the confidence to raise my hand for my first Ninth Circuit argument a couple of years later, and the rest is history!

Did you know about appellate work in law school? If not, when and how did it first get on your radar and why were you drawn to it?

I was fortunate to learn about appellate work in law school through the Moot Court program.

Tell us about one of your appellate cases that you found particularly meaningful.

When I was a mid-level associate, I was given the opportunity to argue before the California Supreme Court on a pro bono matter.  My firm filed an amicus brief on behalf of Bet Tzedek and the Legal Aid Foundation of Los Angeles in favor of a tenants’ rights law passed by the City of Santa Monica.  The City of Santa Monica liked our brief so much that they agreed to split their oral argument time with us.  The primary partner on the case handed the argument to me.  I was excited and terrified.  I remember sitting in the courthouse and looking around at the other lawyers who were slated to argue that day and thinking, wow – I’m the only woman, the only person of color, and the youngest by far!  It was very cool.  The argument itself is all a haze!

How often do you encounter other Arabs in the appellate field? Why do you think that representation is important?

I can’t think of other Arab Americans I’ve encountered in the appellate field.  Because we do not have our own classification, it’s hard for us to easily find peers throughout the legal profession.  Hopefully that will change once we eventually get our North African/Middle Eastern (“MENA”) census designation.  But I know that when I talk to law students and speak to the many MENA student organizations popping up around the country, representation absolutely matters.  If you can see it, you can be it.  

What advice would you give to a law student of color who aspires to be where you are now?

Two tips: (1) work hard – don’t prioritize networking over studying; and (2) clerk.  

What’s one thing law schools and/or the appellate bar can do to ensure our highest courts are representative of all our communities?

Law schools should encourage all students to apply for clerkships, judges should actively hire law clerks from underrepresented communities, and the appellate bar should provide oral argument opportunities to junior associates and lawyers from underrepresented communities.